Comments on: Can an attractional church be missional? http://www.daveingland.com/2010/01/21/can-an-attractional-church-be-missional/ Commentary and discussion on the missional church, faith, culture, media and more... Fri, 30 Jul 2010 15:41:49 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0 By: Muri http://www.daveingland.com/2010/01/21/can-an-attractional-church-be-missional/comment-page-1/#comment-1589 Muri Wed, 16 Jun 2010 21:52:46 +0000 http://www.daveingland.com/?p=1067#comment-1589 Hi Milt, I heard you retired from HUD and was trying to get ahold of you. Please contact me at your earliest convenience. Thanks Muri Hi Milt,

I heard you retired from HUD and was trying to get ahold of you. Please contact me at your earliest convenience.

Thanks
Muri

]]> By: daveingland http://www.daveingland.com/2010/01/21/can-an-attractional-church-be-missional/comment-page-1/#comment-1279 daveingland Wed, 27 Jan 2010 01:27:34 +0000 http://www.daveingland.com/?p=1067#comment-1279 Josh, good word here. While both the attractional and missional models of church can be considered Biblical, I think we as people try to define one as being better than other way too often. Josh, good word here. While both the attractional and missional models of church can be considered Biblical, I think we as people try to define one as being better than other way too often.

]]> By: Josh Roberts http://www.daveingland.com/2010/01/21/can-an-attractional-church-be-missional/comment-page-1/#comment-1274 Josh Roberts Wed, 27 Jan 2010 00:17:28 +0000 http://www.daveingland.com/?p=1067#comment-1274 Hey Dave, I'm not so sure America in it's entirety are "post-Christian. I think most people in the heartland of the country are very church and God-focused. Needless to say, I believe both the attractional model and the missional models are biblical. Jesus called to out to some to, "come and see" while also sending out the 72 to "go and preach/proclaim." I believe in order for the Church to be effective, we need both the "come and see" and the "go and preach" models. Both only will "work" as we are lead by the Holy Spirit. Now on to your follow up post. Hey Dave, I’m not so sure America in it’s entirety are “post-Christian. I think most people in the heartland of the country are very church and God-focused.

Needless to say, I believe both the attractional model and the missional models are biblical. Jesus called to out to some to, “come and see” while also sending out the 72 to “go and preach/proclaim.” I believe in order for the Church to be effective, we need both the “come and see” and the “go and preach” models. Both only will “work” as we are lead by the Holy Spirit.

Now on to your follow up post.

]]> By: Should the attractional and missional church stand divided? | daveingland.com http://www.daveingland.com/2010/01/21/can-an-attractional-church-be-missional/comment-page-1/#comment-1265 Should the attractional and missional church stand divided? | daveingland.com Tue, 26 Jan 2010 11:23:10 +0000 http://www.daveingland.com/?p=1067#comment-1265 [...] Some things I feel have been reinforced, yet some things have been re-shaped. As I posted last week here, I do believe that there is a division between the attractional church model vs missional [...] [...] Some things I feel have been reinforced, yet some things have been re-shaped. As I posted last week here, I do believe that there is a division between the attractional church model vs missional [...]

]]> By: daveingland http://www.daveingland.com/2010/01/21/can-an-attractional-church-be-missional/comment-page-1/#comment-1259 daveingland Sun, 24 Jan 2010 22:50:22 +0000 http://www.daveingland.com/?p=1067#comment-1259 Jeff, there are definitely several ways to look at the contrasts between the attractional vs missional model of church. I agree that culture does play a role in this and I sense that culture in our post-Christian, post-church America i dictating that the church become more missional to connect with unchurched and unbelieving people. Therefore many people are asking the question: Can the attractional church be (fully) missional. It's a relevant question today and one that we need to view with an open mind for the sake of carrying the gospel to those outside of the contemporary, attractional church. Thanks for your feedback! Jeff, there are definitely several ways to look at the contrasts between the attractional vs missional model of church. I agree that culture does play a role in this and I sense that culture in our post-Christian, post-church America i dictating that the church become more missional to connect with unchurched and unbelieving people. Therefore many people are asking the question: Can the attractional church be (fully) missional. It’s a relevant question today and one that we need to view with an open mind for the sake of carrying the gospel to those outside of the contemporary, attractional church. Thanks for your feedback!

]]> By: richardsjeff http://www.daveingland.com/2010/01/21/can-an-attractional-church-be-missional/comment-page-1/#comment-1255 richardsjeff Sun, 24 Jan 2010 02:32:33 +0000 http://www.daveingland.com/?p=1067#comment-1255 I wonder if some of the keys to this question can be found in the differences between the more Jewish church(es) ala Peter and the gentile churches ala Paul in the first century. And certainly there was even a mix depending on the culture and what people were use to. Perhaps this is what it boils down to, the culture and what people are familiar with. It does seem, to me anyway, that an attractional church might have a harder time allowing/enabling people to become more ministerial and see themselves as active participants in the gospel and kingdom, as opposed to missional churches, which is exactly the essence as I view and understand it. exactly I wonder if some of the keys to this question can be found in the differences between the more Jewish
church(es) ala Peter and the gentile churches ala Paul in the first century. And certainly there was even a mix depending on the culture and what people were use to. Perhaps this is what it boils down to, the culture and what people are familiar with. It does seem, to me anyway, that an attractional church might have a harder time allowing/enabling people to become more ministerial and see themselves as active participants in the gospel and kingdom, as opposed to missional churches, which
is exactly the essence as I view and understand it.
exactly

]]> By: daveingland http://www.daveingland.com/2010/01/21/can-an-attractional-church-be-missional/comment-page-1/#comment-1254 daveingland Sun, 24 Jan 2010 01:52:36 +0000 http://www.daveingland.com/?p=1067#comment-1254 Lisa, I can tell you that it's incredibly hard to build credibility and respect amongst the established church leadership and being fully independent for the sake of continuing the vision of such a new and radically different ministry (in modern day terms) leads to small churches impacting small parts of the community. I do believe the day will come when this type of community in harmony with the greater church-at-large may be what is considered traditional. However, there are always going to be the Christian that wants to be fed God's Word through a public speaker on Sundays and they'll only sing certain songs in certain styles, etc. The balance of all things church is the struggle, but the fact that it causes traditions to be broken when many don't think there is anything wrong with the normative tradition is where we happen to be right now. As an individual I see it being so great to be in a post-church society doing things in fresh ways. As the leader of a small church, it can be disheartening and frustrating when other leaders can't support organic movements, which ironically happen to be how the first century was established in the first place. This is probably best-suited as an independent blog post :) Thanks for your participation in the dialog here! Lisa, I can tell you that it’s incredibly hard to build credibility and respect amongst the established church leadership and being fully independent for the sake of continuing the vision of such a new and radically different ministry (in modern day terms) leads to small churches impacting small parts of the community. I do believe the day will come when this type of community in harmony with the greater church-at-large may be what is considered traditional. However, there are always going to be the Christian that wants to be fed God’s Word through a public speaker on Sundays and they’ll only sing certain songs in certain styles, etc. The balance of all things church is the struggle, but the fact that it causes traditions to be broken when many don’t think there is anything wrong with the normative tradition is where we happen to be right now. As an individual I see it being so great to be in a post-church society doing things in fresh ways. As the leader of a small church, it can be disheartening and frustrating when other leaders can’t support organic movements, which ironically happen to be how the first century was established in the first place. This is probably best-suited as an independent blog post :) Thanks for your participation in the dialog here!

]]> By: daveingland http://www.daveingland.com/2010/01/21/can-an-attractional-church-be-missional/comment-page-1/#comment-1253 daveingland Sun, 24 Jan 2010 01:46:12 +0000 http://www.daveingland.com/?p=1067#comment-1253 Jody, I appreciate your insight and thought-provoking reply! For the purposes of this post though, I'm not trying to stir the debate over numbers or baptisms. I'm simply asking the question: Can the attractional church be (fully) missional? I agree that it will require churches with different styles and philosophies to reach the world. Some will be more focused on preaching/teaching those already in relationship with Christ, while others will look to be relational with the world-at-large that does not know the Lord. I do, however, believe that the missional church is better-positioned to disciple believers because they are at the heart of the Greatest Commandment and the second, of loving our neighbor as ourselves. Our neighbors should not always look like us, think like us, or believe like us. More in my follow-up post. Thanks again :) Jody, I appreciate your insight and thought-provoking reply! For the purposes of this post though, I’m not trying to stir the debate over numbers or baptisms. I’m simply asking the question: Can the attractional church be (fully) missional? I agree that it will require churches with different styles and philosophies to reach the world. Some will be more focused on preaching/teaching those already in relationship with Christ, while others will look to be relational with the world-at-large that does not know the Lord. I do, however, believe that the missional church is better-positioned to disciple believers because they are at the heart of the Greatest Commandment and the second, of loving our neighbor as ourselves. Our neighbors should not always look like us, think like us, or believe like us. More in my follow-up post. Thanks again :)

]]> By: daveingland http://www.daveingland.com/2010/01/21/can-an-attractional-church-be-missional/comment-page-1/#comment-1252 daveingland Sun, 24 Jan 2010 01:41:37 +0000 http://www.daveingland.com/?p=1067#comment-1252 John, I would differ in saying that it's not necessarily a bad question as I think the attractional churches will strive to be more missional in the future. It's a reasonable way to see more multi-culturalism and disciple-building can happen. However, I do agree that choosing sides and standing steadfast can lead to bad things. I was formerly in one of those camps and I'm starting to have a shift in my thinking and interested to see how others respond to that shift. You'll get a better idea of the heart of the matter from my perspective in my follow-up post. Thanks!!! John, I would differ in saying that it’s not necessarily a bad question as I think the attractional churches will strive to be more missional in the future. It’s a reasonable way to see more multi-culturalism and disciple-building can happen. However, I do agree that choosing sides and standing steadfast can lead to bad things. I was formerly in one of those camps and I’m starting to have a shift in my thinking and interested to see how others respond to that shift. You’ll get a better idea of the heart of the matter from my perspective in my follow-up post. Thanks!!!

]]> By: daveingland http://www.daveingland.com/2010/01/21/can-an-attractional-church-be-missional/comment-page-1/#comment-1251 daveingland Sun, 24 Jan 2010 01:38:26 +0000 http://www.daveingland.com/?p=1067#comment-1251 Thanks Rick! Hopefully we'll be more in line philosphically regarding the church once you read my follow up post :) Thanks Rick! Hopefully we’ll be more in line philosphically regarding the church once you read my follow up post :)

]]>